Where did he say it does? As best I can tell, he was arguing that a suit is appropriate in some situations in much the same way showering, deodorant and combing your hair is appropriate in some situations- and detracts from your identity no more than showering et al does, either.
"...this self esteem movement that pretty much feels that you're born great and you don't need to change a thing. Wrong! We all have things we need to work on. It's good to fit in with society."
You have to understand the geniuses who see things in new light, those who are doing things in a new but better way will always differ from the mainstream. If we establish a culture that encourages conformity--to ANY degree--then we'd be doing a disservice to innovative culture.
That is, being "weird" or different to ANY degree is NEVER bad so long as you aren't hurting anyone. But the weird guy might be on to something and you don't want to ever miss out on that.
So we should encourage people to be themselves because being themselves could mean the difference between being awesome or being normal.
Smelling bad and looking bad are quite different things. When you smell back you are actually negatively physically affect those around you. Just like being a psychopath isn't mainstream and would be considered weird, but obviously that affects others in a negative way.
I'll eat my candy with the pork and beans... not because I'm trying to make a statement, but because that's how I've always been doing it, even if it's different from how you do it. No one has the right to tell me the way I've been doing things is inferior or bad. Only reality can decide that.
>Or are you staunchly against those things, too?
I'm not staunchly against those things and I never said I am. I'm simply staunchly for people being who they are and never faking to fit in. It never helps, and only hurts.
This is the argument I usually take. WHY is it better to wear a suit besides the investors want to see you in one? If someone willing to put hundreds of thousands of dollars into my business won't do so because I don't wear what's effectively a costume, what's going to stop them being capricious about future issues?
I don't find the suit thing any less ridiculous then if an investor specified that they wanted all board minutes printed in Tahoma because it "sharpens the mind".
Showering and deodorant is a distracting straw man.
It certainly is, and the fact that people go there shows how empty the argument is.
I'm still surprised at the consensus in this thread. Hopefully it's a random blip and not the white blood cells finally figuring out where we've all been :)
I'm not ready to conclude that the argument is empty, but I do think it's interesting that instead of presenting actual arguments, people seem to be getting defensive.
To me that suggests that whatever the real reason is, people aren't comfortable with it. We won't know until someone actually gives a reason though.
"... it's about showing respect for the guys you're meeting, showing that you want to be taken seriously, that you care, and that you take the meeting seriously..."
I may be interpreting this incorrectly, but those qualify as things that may make you a better person (in said situation) as you are showing respect for the other individual.
You can show respect by taking people seriously, being on time, putting in effort, and countless other objectively practical things.
Wearing a suit is only considered by some to be respectful because of cultural conditioning. Unfortunately cultural norms are not objective.
I am 21. I have never worn a suit before and it's not because I actively choose not to or oppose it. I simply have never come to a situation where I was told why I needed to wear a suit. Therefore I have never been conditioned to do so as the norm.
But I can understand that if I do not show up on time, if I ignore or talk over others that these are objectively disrespectful actions because they negatively affect others.
If anyone is still stuck in the thinking that dressing up in a suit (which has no practical consequences to any matters on hand) then they are completely missing the point.
I'll show my fucking respect by doing my best, not being a dick, taking people seriously, and if people refuse to recognize that true respect simply because I didn't dress up nicely to conform to their cultural standards then it's their loss.
Sure, it is their loss. But if they're giving you a job, or giving you money, then you're losing out too. And there are a lot of social routines where certain costumes are expected - funerals, weddings, etc.
Good luck, because the clothes thing is infuriating. Just remember that a lot of people are stupid.
It's fun to play thought experiments. Imagine you didn't want to work on weapons, but those employers had casual dress policy, versus the socially aware company which needs you to wear a suit. Which bit of integrity would you abandon?
Er.. if you wanted to keep your integrity you could work at neither.
Your hypothetical situation is contrived. Plus you can always start your own company.
There are very few situations where your only option to keep your integrity boiled down to death and even then people have chosen death over giving up their integrity.
Not for me - I hate that desert island moral dilemma thing. Inevitably, what is really being asked is "What would a person in a contrived puzzle situation say"?
This. I've never understood why people aren't offended by obvious attempts to manipulate them using something as shallow as a costume. It's a dead giveaway that I'm expecting to meet at least one person I haven't begun taking seriously. (Which is not to say I'm above doing that to people who I believe will expect it.)
