I wouldn't take that advice seriously. Suit in tech would be awkward (even for most mgmt roles). Tech pioneered the concept that you don't need a suit to get the pay of a suit. You can be yourself.
As I learned, you can also be yourself, never wear a suit on the job and still wear one for the interview. First impressions count. Once people know I can wear a suit they just don't seem to mind me in shorts anymore.. So I might have a social skill after all :D
I'd want to see some actual hard evidence before I believed that. The usual way social cues work is they are devastatingly effective even if people claim they are not. Much like how most interviewers are honestly convinced that their approach is unbiased but in practice they tend to hire people who are like themselves.
My expectation is that turning up in a suit would get better results. The effect is probably smaller in hard-skill roles but I'd assume still present.
I agree, but I suspect that you’d have much better luck if you wore something that was superficially similar to the kinds of things other people wore, but was much better fitted and higher quality. For instance, if you showed up in a nice pair of chinos and a tailored buttoned shirt (of appropriate formality), that might come across as being really put together rather than ignoring subtle social cues by dressing in something that stands out by not fitting in.
I don't know where you live but for most tech jobs here even outside of sv its almost as bad as putting your photo on a resume. Even for very senior non-technical roles you're better off showing up in slacks and a blazer than the whole enchilada
Wearing a suit to a tech interview in silicon valley would without a doubt send the signal that either (a) they have absolutely no clue about SV work culture, or (b) they’re a “look at me” guy who dresses odd on purpose
If they're young it can also be because that's what they've been told to do, if they're from a different culture (even an American one) it may be shockingly weird not to wear a suit to an interview, and there are even people who wear suits all the time because a well-made suit is very comfortable, with no more showing off involved than dressing up any other way. An interview is not a regular work day, best not to summarily judge people like that.
My point is that even knowing the work culture of SV does not mean that people necessarily believe it applies to interviews too, or that a suit will be a negative point, rather than good or neutral. There is a strong culture of looking smart at interviews that overrides knowledge of day-to-day attire. If you really care about people being in casual clothes, mention it in the invite, rather than looking down on them for doing what has been ingrained to be appropriate.
First impressions do count but I think the above poster has a point, a suit can actually harm your chances in an environment where no one wears suits.
There are many ways to wear a suit. If you walking in wearing a suit that doesn't fit, doesn't suite (no pun intended) you, and it obviously makes you feel uncomfortable then that could count against you. But you walk in wearing a suit that fits, makes you look good, and that you are comfortable wearing, then I have a hard time seeing how it will count against you.
Wearing a suit to a technical interview is an immediate red flag. Everybody knows you don't wear suits in this industry, so what's your motive? Your ability to wear a suit is irrelevant for the job, so what weaknesses that are relevant are you rather clumsily trying to hide?
I've gotten a job offer from every technical interview I ever took in a suit, so it Worked For Me. And none of the jobs that I took I ever wore a suit to again (except for conferences or trade shows, and occasionally when I was going out after work to somewhere posh, which did provoke fun "Omg are you interviewing" questions!) Which I actually have found a bit of a shame because I do quite like a chance to wear a suit, though I'm also grateful not to have to iron infinite shirts.
Admittedly I thankfully wasn't in the SV bubble where people are wound this tightly about it!
An interview is not a regular work day. If only things relevant to the job were required in an interview, no one would be talking about whiteboard exercises.
Calling it a red flag may have been too harsh. It's certainly not an immediate no.
However, like it or not, it is a signal because it means you deviate significantly from the mode of the distribution. And a sober application of Bayes suggests that if anything, all else equal that signal is a negative one.
I would go as far as to say being this hyper-focused on clothes rather than if the person is sociable and competent is a red flag itself. It is rather superficial. Vague platitudes about "culture" might get thrown out, but are we engineering and building things or are we putting on a fashion show?
If there is a de facto dress code and you knowingly go against it, even if you look good in whatever you do wear, it makes you look like you don't understand the prevailing norms. This could lead to worries you might not align with other team norms either.
If it's so important, the interview invite should mention that casual wear is expected. Like it or not, most people take interviews seriously, and have been taught that you show you take the interview seriously by wearing a suit.
Tbh, people who blindly accept what they've been taught without considering the situation at hand don't make good engineers anyway (software or otherwise). It's not like programmers not wearing suits is some well-kept secret only accessible to the inner circle. Quite the opposite I'd say.
It's well known that programmers don't wear suits in the office in the SV. It's less obvious they shouldn't wear one in the interview either, because that's not a regular work day. It's not obvious at all to someone from a formal-dress culture like France (Italy? India?). Google's own AI recommends erring on the side of caution and wearing a suit for an SV interview. Yes, people should look up the specific company they're interviewing for... if it even comes to their mind, it's that obvious interviews require suits in some cultures.
If you forgive me the analogy, and assuming you're American, would you think of checking the etiquette of entering into a shop? In the US, the concept itself is weird, you go in, buy stuff, and leave. In France, you must greet the shopkeeper right as you go in through the door. In Hungary, you must wish the shopkeeper a good day in reply to their greeting. It's simple... if you know it's even a thing you should check.
Which is funny, because weren't we in tech the people who aspired to “think different”? But then it didn't become think-different for the individual but for the tech in-group against the "square", boring, formality-driven out-group. And since the world is becoming increasingly informal and any group worth its salt needs to differentiate itself, tech people might be the first to return to wearing suits and ties (or dresses) to work. I'd love that.
"Think different" was a marketing slogan used for Apple products from 1997 to 2002, back when Apple was aimed chiefly at video editing professionals. It was never aimed at techies.
As long as suits and ties remain the uniform of politicians and managers, I don't think techies will ever willingly adopt it for themselves as well.
With reference to the GP about awkward people, if an adult hiring manager is intimidated by an professional applicant wearing a suit to an interview in good faith (after all, it's widely seen as mark of taking the interview seriously), I think it is perhaps not the applicant who need to learn the social skills.
If an interviewer can't tell the difference between a flex and show of good intent, they probably should go back to jobs where they don't need to make judgements of character.
can you just ask them before the interview? "is it okay to wear a suit, or do you guys have a stick up your..."?
I personally dress like a hobo when I'm out and about, and wear a uniform of jeans and a blue shirt when I go into the office, so I really don't care about the suit either way. I'm wearing it for your benefit, so if you don't like it, just tell me upfront - don't make me guess if the job isn't about mindreading.
Seeing someone wearing a suit for a dev interview would make me think one of the following:
(1) This person really really needs the job. Probably is in a bad negotiation position, due to this urgent need.
(2) Are you here to impress people with looks, or with your skills?
(3) They take looks way more serious than they should, maybe not focussing enough on the technical side of things.
(4) Hopefully this is not an "EnTeRpRiSe software" developer, and if they are, hopefully they don't work on my team and if they are, hopefully my next up manager does not get blinded by fancy clothes, instead of technical reasoning.
That said, I would try to keep an open mind about the person, but they would be initially sorted into the category of managerial or close to management, rather than close to the other engineers, which is not a positive signal to send.
This feels like such a narrow view of the world. Not necessarily discriminatory, but on the path to get there.
So what if a candidate wants to look good? How you feel about your looks affects your confidence, and you want to be confident in an interview.
And like, if a candidate came in with a well groomed beard would you think “he probably spends too much time on his beard, he must be a bad programmer”? I bet you don’t.
I’m not trying to criticize you too much, but this just feels antithetical to everything that tech stands for. You get judged on your merits, not on anything else. This way of thinking is how you create an environment hostile to women and minorities.
Our industry in north america is known for lots its egotistical slobs, but I thought that was changing.
> So what if a candidate wants to look good? How you feel about your looks affects your confidence, and you want to be confident in an interview.
Like it or not, if someone needs to wear a suit to feel confident that says something about them. It may just be a personality quirk of them unrelated to their skills, but it often is not. There’s no reason you need to wear a suit to feel confident.
> You get judged on your merits, not on anything else. This way of thinking is how you create an environment hostile to women and minorities.
How often does tech discriminate for “culture fit” reasons? Someone’s personality fit is often a huge point of contention, and wearing a suit is part of someone’s personality and choices.
I’m not advocating for it being an absolute state, but you certainly have to give some consideration to the fact that dressing up far more than is needed implies you don’t culturally understand. It’s as simple as that.
You do see how discriminatory your statement is right?
Replace “wearing a suit” with literally anything else unrelated to programming skills. Wearing a dress. Having a particular speech pattern. Being old.
As soon as you start judging people for anything other than their performance you fucked up. People’s personality comes through in the interview process. By the end of an hour working with someone you should have a pretty good idea of what working with them is like, suit or no suit.
> I’m not advocating for it being an absolute state, but you certainly have to give some consideration to the fact that dressing up far more than is needed implies you don’t culturally understand. It’s as simple as that.
I'm not saying you immediately throw a candidate out for wearing a suit. It's entirely possible I'm wrong and my mind can be changed by their performance, but it is something that would make me take a closer look.
I'll give you another example I experienced recently: a candidate who would not stop drumming their fingers on the table throughout the interview. Is that specifically related to their performance? No, not really. Is it annoying, a bit disrespectful, and shows a lack of restraint? Yeah, it is. This candidate had other flaws that made them disqualifying, but their finger drumming didn't help them at all.
I understand and respect your decision to moderate my comment, and I’ll be more careful going forward.
But I would like to point out that a rule that allows someone to openly state they discriminate during interviews but forbids a strong reaction to that statement might require some examination.
You’re welcome to disagree with people and present your opposing view, but we just need you to do so without escalating into hostility and personal insults. This site exists to be a place of curious conversation, not a battleground.
Respectfully, what I’m describing is not discrimination in the hiring sense. Discrimination is unfair treatment related to immutable characteristics about a person such as race, age, gender, etc.
You could just as easily argue that people “discriminate” against candidates by making them do leetcode, when leetcode is unrelated to performance at the job. Leetcode is a performance some people look at during interviews, just like how you socially meld in an interview is a performance people look at during interviews.
Wearing jeans and a T-shirt doesn’t make anyone a slob. Also, there’s ways you can be a slob even in a suit.
I’d suggest you reacquaint yourself with the comment guidelines, as this just is a simple ad hominem attack on me, despite not even making any claims as to what I wear to work.
> So what if a candidate wants to look good? How you feel about your looks affects your confidence, and you want to be confident in an interview.
But that is also a narrow view of the world, no? Who says a suit looks good? What if I think pajamas looks good? I am exaggerating of course, but I often think suits don't look particularly better or anything. It is just some random norm, that society has ascribed to that particular piece of clothing. I often find simple, one color only, no writing on it, clothing looking better.
> And like, if a candidate came in with a well groomed beard would you think “he probably spends too much time on his beard, he must be a bad programmer”? I bet you don’t.
I don't, but I do get a sense of them possibly being a bit vain. But more importantly, I think about why I don't wear such a beard. It is annoying when eating, and I don't want my beard in my food. So I will be a little bit baffled by their choice, but it is their choice anyway. I don't have to like it.
You probably wear suits that fit and the confidence probably shows through. Not to stereotype, but I suspect a large number of developers have one or two suits they wear for job interviews, weddings and funerals, and they bought them long enough ago that they are too loose or too snug by now, and consequently feel uncomfortable when wearing them. At least this used to be me.
Personally, I feel uncomfortable in any suit, not because of size or fit, but because I must be wary not to make it dirty at all, otherwise cleaning is a pita. Say you want to go for lunch with coworkers and someone orders spaghetti/pasta. Great ... I rather wear something simple, so there is no problem, if something unfortunate happens.
