Are you aware that Egypt holds 16,000 to 20,000 people under administrative detention. A similar number is found in Japan. I can't find numbers for Australia, but I think it's number is also over 10,000. The highest number that I could find for Israel is 3000.

For what it's worth, a guy I'm friendly with (not a friend per se, but we've exchanged phone numbers and talk on the phone) had his son in administrative detention for several weeks. Probably more than a month. There was no "plan" to let him go, the police released him when it was deemed that the circumstances of his arrest did not merit further procedure.

Article 9 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights states that "No one shall be subjected to arbitrary arrest, detention or exile."

But you knew this: it just didn't suit whatever defense of Israel you were trying to make.

In any case, at least in Israel, the vast, vast majority of those under administrative detention are held for violent acts such as throwing stones, molotov cocktails, etc. There are a few cases in which the authorities have not stated reason, I know this, but that number is in the single digits. Administrative detention is not a violation of Article 9.

I'm not excusing it, I'm putting it in perspective. For what it's worth, I personally am against the whole idea of administrative detention in any country. If a government body detains someone, the reason should be clear and transparent before the arresting officer punches out of his shift.

And your equivalence of administrative detention to the taking of babies hostage and murdering them and their mothers in captivity only reinforces the notion that those who oppose the state of Israel are generally unreasonable and lack the morals which form the basis of a stable, productive Western society.

Your reply to my post does not seem to address anything it said (or indeed, anything of substance), but it is noted that you, 1 person out of billions, disagree very, very strongly with both international and scholarly consensus, which I merely repeated, and which are each individually more authoritative than your opinion. Thank you for your invaluable contribution and have a nice day!

I did no such thing - I just joined the thread, go lick a battery and calm down.

But seriously, this tactic of hysterically conflating replies in a long, tedious reply to create a straw-man which then becomes the topic is taught to propagandists and zealots the world over.

Source: my govt taught it to me.

And it's been over forty years since I've last licked a 9V! The sensation and taste were exactly as I remembered.

I bet most IDF personnel would think that. You really need to disclose this sorta thing before you accuse other people of lacking moral fabric or international perspective.

I would have an honest discussion on-grounds with you about this, because it seems like we're in agreement that the detention is bad. But your (quoted) conclusion is hysterically disproportionate, and does not reflect any opinion you are qualified to tender. Furthermore, the parent is right; you know exactly what I am referring to, admit it is an issue, then pretend that we're the dumb ones when we demand accountability. It is a bad-faith tactic that you are deliberately employing to deflect valid criticism of Israel. So instead of stimulating discussion I will just tell you this, expedite some shit slinging and let you react however you like.

Most of us here are willing to put things in perspective. I'll show some vulnerability, I'm a US citizen. Abu Ghraib turns my stomach, the 1953 coup and the SAVAK files make me appalled. But I also know those aren't the scariest skeletons in the closet, so do you. Neither of us probably want to talk about the lingering consequences of apartheid, or the fact that the US has knowingly supported no fewer than three genocides in the past century (Bangladesh, Rwanda, now Gaza). They're horrible, world-defining revelations. Which is why we both have to look past the phenomena, which tells us they are justifiable, to interact directly with the geist, the actual truth.

As Americans and Israelis, we are partners whether we like it or not. We have the benefit of hindsight (both countries individually!), to admit that empire politics are worthless. 21st century colonialism is pointless. It is a waste of human life, and for what? To subvert a free market economy we're both ultimately at the whims of? If Israel wants to play the long game, my wholly empathetic opinion is that they need international credibility. There is still a road for the Israeli state to persist with international - perhaps even Arab - support. The first step on that road starts by unseating a president who only demands war and resists his corruption charges. Supporting this war is literally killing Israel as a functioning nation, which sickens me, as an American. I'm still advocating for an expedient and fair trial for those prisoners because someone has to care about Israel even if Netenyahu won't.

Not really. Hamas should unilaterally return the hostages. They're not getting any negotiating points by keeping them.

But Israel prosecuting the war as it has is permanently debilitating its long-term security and economic prospects. (Its zenith was probably after its Iranian bombing campaign. Tel Aviv should have withdrawn then and fallen back to targeted bombings of Hamas leadership.)

If the economic prospects are being debilitated, it is only because people are actually believing in the narrative that Hamas has hoped they’d be manipulated into believing, through a sustained campaign of disruptive rioting and propaganda - all while trying to not talk about the decades-long rocket attacks, the murder/rape of October 7, etc. But it’s silly for the world to fall for this narrative when it is clear who the aggressors are. Only one of these parties fundamentally believes in genocide of the other party - and that’s Hamas, per their own statements about their goals.

As for the long-term security - this I am not clear on. Why do you think Israel’s security has been reduced? I think it will be very hard for Hamas to regroup quickly to the extent that it has been built up previously (especially thanks to Qatar’s help). But if left alone rather than stamped out, I think eventually they will build up strength and in 20 years we’ll have the next October 7. I think Israel’s only choice is to put a definitive end to Islamic terrorism.